Just Some Grumbling

Marko, what you said reminds me of a concept called “security theater,” which you may already be familiar with. A lot of what TSA does is unnecessary and a waste, but somehow it is supposed to give travelers a (false) sense of security.

I remember being on a domestic flight in Sweden about 20 years ago. Before landing, the pilot opened the cockpit door, and a passenger (who was his friend) went and sat in a jump seat between the pilot and co-pilot. The cockpit door remained open for the entire landing, and all the passengers were able to look into the cockpit and see the runway ahead.

There’s something I don’t ever expect to be able to see again.

If anyone wants a little read, here’s an interesting link:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Security_theater

Good article - one also has to consider whether all the "enhanced" security measures and police powers were ever actually intended to address "international terrorism" or was actually intended to be used on the domestic kind?

The whole theatre concept extends to other areas of human activity. Take the environmental movement, the appearance of doing something to save the world absolutely trumps reality. Some will say that it can't hurt, but it absolutely can. If you're pouring your hard earned money (more often its someone else's hard earned money in the form of taxes) down the drain in environmental theatre initiatives its not only economically wasteful but it prevents those resources being employed in perhaps a more productive manner..... sorry, I digress

Sitting in the Washington/Dulles airport right now waiting on an 8:12 AM flight.  Got to the airport at 5AM to miss the lines. By 6 AM you wait an hour.  

I am tall so the idea of having to pay extra for leg room grinds at my core.  

Airlines don't care,  TSA pretends and we continue to take the abuse.  I had to take this trip for work but find less and less the notion of air travel nothing more than a chore and emotional drain.

Next summer we are looking to go out west and have looked at the train rather then the plane to avoid the hassle.  Takes longer but I don't have to deal with the hassle of air travel.


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Cincinnatus I feel your pain, I'm just over 6'2" and my son is 6'7" and we often have to pay to get into the emergency exit seats. Its pretty awful otherwise. Always a bummer when those seats are gone and on boarding you notice that they're occupied by persons for whom the normal seats provide ample space.

We took the train a couple of years back on a trip from Toronto to Montreal - Quebec City and back and it was wonderful. Very leisurely and civilized. Boarding was straightforward - you carried your bag up to the train and left it on a cart beside the door and hopped on. Train stations tend to be in the centre of cities so it makes getting to and from hotels easier and less stressful.

Sitting in the Washington/Dulles airport right now waiting on an 8:12 AM flight.  Got to the airport at 5AM to miss the lines. By 6 AM you wait an hour.  

I am tall so the idea of having to pay extra for leg room grinds at my core.  

Airlines don't care,  TSA pretends and we continue to take the abuse.  I had to take this trip for work but find less and less the notion of air travel nothing more than a chore and emotional drain.

Next summer we are looking to go out west and have looked at the train rather then the plane to avoid the hassle.  Takes longer but I don't have to deal with the hassle of air travel.


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I live in San Diego and visit a friend in Buffalo twice a year.  He has been urging me to take the train instead of fly.  However, my time in Buffalo is usually about nine days, making the six day round trip train ride impractical, to say the least.  Also, a sleeper cabin on the train can be prohibitively expensive.

As was stated earlier is true because what option do many of us have?  Walk?  And the airlines know it.

I fly often for work also. Anymore, if the location I am traveling is 11 hours away or less, I drive. I figure it this way, with having to get the airport around two hours early, that's 150 miles of drive time I would be sitting in the airport anyway. Add a three hour layover that's 225 miles of drive time; so without "moving" in the air, I could have moved 375 miles in the car. 2 hour flight time or so another 150 miles.... add waiting for bags, getting a rental car, etc etc.... another 75 miles or so. There have been many of times I have gotten to my motel room and thought had I driven, I could have been here at the same time and often EARLIER than had I flown. Car seats have more room, no crying babies, no foul smelling passengers, I can control the climate where I sit and the list goes on. Not to mention I don't need the added pain is the ass rental cars can be when I arrive.

It is said that the average cost to drive a car per mile in the US is 60 cents now.... gas, wear and tear on tires, vehicle depreciation, oil changes, etc. While I think this figure is extremely high, even using this figure, the cost of driving 800 miles would be $480.00 often times lower than my plane ticket anyway.

To me the question becomes why would anyone fly if they could drive?

We took the train a couple of years back on a trip from Toronto to Montreal - Quebec City and back and it was wonderful.  Very leisurely and civilized.  Boarding was straightforward - you carried your bag up to the train and left it on a cart beside the door and hopped on.  Train stations tend to be in the centre of cities so it makes getting to and from hotels easier and less stressful.

I took the train from Quebec City to Montreal a few years back and it was really nice. It was a enjoyable trip and walked from the hotel to the train station.

I have taken the train from Illinois out to Raton, NM a couple times and it was nice. I was able to read a lot and just relaxed. No two hour advance check-in - just took our bags to the luggage compartment and then sat down.


Posted by steeleshaves
I fly often for work also. Anymore, if the location I am traveling is 11 hours away or less, I drive.

I did the same back when I traveled a lot. 6 hour drive to a site in Virginia or a $800 commuter flight. I would rent the car locally and drive - faster, no issue with equipment I had for work, and saved the company a ton of money since I went there 8 times.

I smile every time I see the old clips of the people carrying the PanAm bag, dressed in their suit or dress getting on the flight. They looked happy like they didn't mind flying.

I travelled frequently with my job years ago before 9-11. The airlines, specifically TWA, valued their customers. Now we're mistreated, overcharged, taxed and taken for granted. I rarely fly an more, I'd rather get kicked in the (your know where) because with time the hurt gets better. Not with air travel - it gets worse. If I do have to fly I try and use South West since their employees are the least rude and crabby and they seem to run a tight ship.

Boy, churchilllafemme, did you ever touch a nerve (and rightfully so, in my opinion)!

I nominate airline staff and related airport security staff as the most odious professions - dentists can breathe a sigh of relief. At least with a dentist the pain ends and you end up with good dental health!!

I am so glad I don't fly! I have no need to or desire to. After reading all of the preceding, and enduring that, after I got to my destination I'd only want to get back to my beloved Maine. I'd have to endure it all over again for possibly 24 hours away.

I can't judge airline staff on a scale of odious professions, but they aren't in among politicians and newsfolks? I always thought they were the lowest of the low, especially lately since they no longer even try to hide "it" anymore. But I don't want to hijack the thread.

TSA is like Sex Panther, but in their case 5% works all the time and you get this