Grooming Dept

I'm not trying to get anyone to have any opinion. I'm not sure why you would even write that. Seems ridiculous on its face. I'm simply one of a group of voices that love the product and don't like the business practices. And I believe I missed free to state that as you are.

You constantly seem to take the side of business practices not mattering. While I constantly take the side of business practices matter every bit as much as the product does. We're probably both right, at least as it relates to our own opinion. And that's why it's good for everyone to put their opinion here. That way everyone can see.

Whether you're tired of my opinion or not isn't relevant to me. I will post it as much as I feel like it. And I hope you do the same. That's what this forum is for. It is not simply for those people that wish to kiss the back sides of the vendor. But that's what it seems to be turning into.

Look, I get it, I used to be a huge fan just like you. I'm not anymore. And there's a real good reason for it. It's the Despicable business practices of this business. That said, the soap is outstanding.

Instead of trying to take me on constantly, you will probably be better served just posting your opinions about what you like and don't like and not commenting on me or my opinions. Do as you see fit though, as will I. And should you decide to comment about what you like or don't like of my posts I will feel free to do the same with yours.

Now on to perhaps what you might consider to be a more relevant topic...

Has anyone tried the base with the donkey milk. Is there any discernible difference between it and say the tallow base?

I'm sorry, but you opened this debate and I find your term "shill" over/miss used and bordering on the offensive.  I am in no way questioning your personal and upsetting experience with Grooming Dept's shipping practices.  However, to call others "shill"s just because they have not had a problem with Mohammad's shipping dates or have been willing to accept what might be missteps on his part is just flat out wrong, at least, and insulting, at most.  You obviously like the gentleman's products.  He has openly admitted missteps.  He has tried to make amends.  He is not a huge multinational corporation.  I am not suggesting you are wrong in your upset but, as others have suggested, sir, walk with your wallet for, surely, that is your right.  Just do not insult others who have differing opinions.

How you "find" things is certainly up to you. Whether you like the term I use or you don't is irrelevant to me.

I am not telling you what to do and you sure will not tell me what to do. Are we clear?

The debate was opened when this Artisan lied to people left and right. I have evidence of that should you wish it. I didn't open anything. I did my best to be a good client. Why you are opining about that is a bit beyond me.

You also seem to think you understand why I call somebody a shill. Maybe it would be better to ask me rather than think you understand. You clearly don't.

The person I was referring to has quite a history both here in this forum and on another one of trying to blame customers for being upset with this Artisans Bad Business practice. This to me, comes across as a shill. If it doesn't to you, that's on you. I write it as I see it. This same person never seems to want to accept that people can be upset over bad business practices. He seems to do everything in his power to shut down people from being upset by placing the blame on them. I won't tolerate it. And will easily put him in his place.

I will also say that I have respect for him on numerous posts that I have seen. That said, there is no excuse for belittling others for legitimate upsets that have happened at the hands of this Merchant who has deplorable business practices.

Again, I have a recorded telephone conversation, and a great number of email exchanges between us that will easily point out the things I have referenced.

This Artisan has admitted mistakes to me from the first order I have made. I've made five or six. I'd have to count them. Each time he admitted mistakes. At what point are they simply going to be corrected to where there need be no more admissions of mistakes?

That he has admitted mistakes would be fine if they weren't continually repeated... the same ones.

Rather than suggest what I do, how about you suggest that businesses be responsible with their customers. That would be a good start.

And rather than suggest I do anything, how about you simply do what you think is best for you. You will have zero influence on what I think is best for me. I am a pretty nice guy all things considered. But lie to me enough, fail to follow through on your word on every single interaction we have, lie to me repeatedly and you will find that I stop being quite so nice. Maybe you're a better man than me if that's not how you would respond as well.

Let me suggest that you keep your nose firmly planted in your own business. You and I have no business together.

Mohammed is a very likable guy. And he produces a great product. I will buy it or not as I see fit in the future. And if I do buy it, I probably will not elect to buy from his website but I would instead buy from a reputable vendor that he supplies. That way I am sure to get the order precisely as expected.

Telling this to a group of people who Could well be in for a very significant surprise as they find their orders don't get delivered as promised, is precisely one of the reasons these forums exist. They do not exist simply to kiss the back sides of every Artisan.

Feel free to ask Mohammed yourself, he and I got along very well. I accepted his apologies at every step. When I finally discovered that he didn't feel responsible for these issues and that they were continuing with every single launch, I decided that I would say my truth.

And my truth is simple the product is great but the business practices behind the product will probably leave you disappointed. Or at least they could well leave you disappointed if they continue on as they have.

That is not being overly negative. It is simply saying the truth.

I was very willing to be done with this until you wrote. Perhaps you should let this lie. You will gain nothing by continuing it.

And the only thing that I wish to gain is to be the voice of reason pointing out issues and discrepancies from the past. Each of us must make our own decision. And it's hard to make a decision when one doesn't know what they're facing.

I will also give credit where credit's due. If I see that release dates are being met, and products are delivered as promised, I will be the first person to also back this change up and be supportive. I really do like Mohammed. And I really will not tolerate deceptive business practices that can hurt people here.

You seem to want it all one way.  You try to invalidate anyone's opinion but your own.  You have insulted me.

You are attempting to bludgeon anyone whose opinion differs from yours.  Also, it has not been one person but several who disagree with you.  Again, I do not disagree with your unhappiness with promises made, and you may, indeed, be correct as far as what you have experienced.  However, others have not experienced what you have or they are willing to accept the missteps of Mohammad.  That, in no way, makes them "shills" so please stop putting them down.  Once again, your wallet is, by far, your best mouthpiece.

I'm sorry, but you opened this debate and I find your term "shill" over/miss used and bordering on the offensive.  I am in no way questioning your personal and upsetting experience with Grooming Dept's shipping practices.  However, to call others "shill"s just because they have not had a problem with Mohammad's shipping dates or have been willing to accept what might be missteps on his part is just flat out wrong, at least, and insulting, at most.  You obviously like the gentleman's products.  He has openly admitted missteps.  He has tried to make amends.  He is not a huge multinational corporation.  I am not suggesting you are wrong in your upset but, as others have suggested, sir, walk with your wallet for, surely, that is your right.  Just do not insult others who have differing opinions.

How you "find" things is certainly up to you. Whether you like the term I use or you don't is irrelevant to me.

I am not telling you what to do and you sure will not tell me what to do. Are we clear?

The debate was opened when this Artisan lied to people left and right. I have evidence of that should you wish it. I didn't open anything. I did my best to be a good client. Why you are opining about that is a bit beyond me.

You also seem to think you understand why I call somebody a shill. Maybe it would be better to ask me rather than think you understand. You clearly don't.

The person I was referring to has quite a history both here in this forum and on another one of trying to blame customers for being upset with this Artisans Bad Business practice. This to me, comes across as a shill. If it doesn't to you, that's on you. I write it as I see it. This same person never seems to want to accept that people can be upset over bad business practices. He seems to do everything in his power to shut down people from being upset by placing the blame on them. I won't tolerate it. And will easily put him in his place.

I will also say that I have respect for him on numerous posts that I have seen. That said, there is no excuse for belittling others for legitimate upsets that have happened at the hands of this Merchant who has deplorable business practices.

Again, I have a recorded telephone conversation, and a great number of email exchanges between us that will easily point out the things I have referenced.

This Artisan has admitted mistakes to me from the first order I have made. I've made five or six. I'd have to count them. Each time he admitted mistakes. At what point are they simply going to be corrected to where there need be no more admissions of mistakes?

That he has admitted mistakes would be fine if they weren't continually repeated... the same ones.

Rather than suggest what I do, how about you suggest that businesses be responsible with their customers. That would be a good start.

And rather than suggest I do anything, how about you simply do what you think is best for you. You will have zero influence on what I think is best for me. I am a pretty nice guy all things considered. But lie to me enough, fail to follow through on your word on every single interaction we have, lie to me repeatedly and you will find that I stop being quite so nice. Maybe you're a better man than me if that's not how you would respond as well.

Let me suggest that you keep your nose firmly planted in your own business. You and I have no business together.

Mohammed is a very likable guy. And he produces a great product. I will buy it or not as I see fit in the future. And if I do buy it, I probably will not elect to buy from his website but I would instead buy from a reputable vendor that he supplies. That way I am sure to get the order precisely as expected.

Telling this to a group of people who Could well be in for a very significant surprise as they find their orders don't get delivered as promised, is precisely one of the reasons these forums exist. They do not exist simply to kiss the back sides of every Artisan.

Feel free to ask Mohammed yourself, he and I got along very well. I accepted his apologies at every step. When I finally discovered that he didn't feel responsible for these issues and that they were continuing with every single launch, I decided that I would say my truth.

And my truth is simple the product is great but the business practices behind the product will probably leave you disappointed. Or at least they could well leave you disappointed if they continue on as they have.

That is not being overly negative. It is simply saying the truth.

I was very willing to be done with this until you wrote. Perhaps you should let this lie. You will gain nothing by continuing it.

And the only thing that I wish to gain is to be the voice of reason pointing out issues and discrepancies from the past. Each of us must make our own decision. And it's hard to make a decision when one doesn't know what they're facing.

I will also give credit where credit's due. If I see that release dates are being met, and products are delivered as promised, I will be the first person to also back this change up and be supportive. I really do like Mohammed. And I really will not tolerate deceptive business practices that can hurt people here.

You seem to want it all one way.  You try to invalidate anyone's opinion but your own.  You have insulted me.

You are attempting to bludgeon anyone whose opinion differs from yours.  Also, it has not been one person but several who disagree with you.  Again, I do not disagree with your unhappiness with promises made, and you may, indeed, be correct as far as what you have experienced.  However, others have not experienced what you have or they are willing to accept the missteps of Mohammad.  That, in no way, makes them "shills" so please stop putting them down.  Once again, your wallet is, by far, your best mouthpiece.

You can choose to feel offended if that is your choice. It was not my intention to offend you. And for the life of me I can't figure out how you could possibly be offended by what I've said to you. Sensitive much?

Offering my opinion of what happened in no way put anyone down. The shill I was referring to has indeed acted as such. That is not you. So why are you even mentioning it?

Whether someone wants to accept the realities of this situation or simply see the positive side that they are spinning, is certainly up to them. Just as it's up to me to determine if that is real or not and then to State my opinion. I've done that.

Perhaps it's time for you to move on now. If that's what you would like me to do, do that as well. Of course, I will wait for a response and if I get one, I will respond to it.

And no, I don't want anything both ways. I have never said that. That's your spin. I have simply said the truth as it affected me. I have not elaborated, in fact I have downplayed what actually happened. I think the truth is important. Whether you would like to focus on one thing at the exclusion of others is certainly up to you. If that's the case, ignore my messages.

And I have little reason to continue writing. Unless you do. Then I will respond. You see, you too don't get to have it both ways. You can't attack me and think I'm not going to respond.

How about you simply drop this. I will if you will. But if anyone responds to me, I will respond back. Deal?

And one thing I do promise... If I see the same behavior from this artisan, I will in fact shout it from the Tree Tops. And I hope you will join me. All of us deserve honorable businesses to buy from.

How you "find" things is certainly up to you. Whether you like the term I use or you don't is irrelevant to me.

I am not telling you what to do and you sure will not tell me what to do. Are we clear?

The debate was opened when this Artisan lied to people left and right. I have evidence of that should you wish it. I didn't open anything. I did my best to be a good client. Why you are opining about that is a bit beyond me.

You also seem to think you understand why I call somebody a shill. Maybe it would be better to ask me rather than think you understand. You clearly don't.

The person I was referring to has quite a history both here in this forum and on another one of trying to blame customers for being upset with this Artisans Bad Business practice. This to me, comes across as a shill. If it doesn't to you, that's on you. I write it as I see it. This same person never seems to want to accept that people can be upset over bad business practices. He seems to do everything in his power to shut down people from being upset by placing the blame on them. I won't tolerate it. And will easily put him in his place.

I will also say that I have respect for him on numerous posts that I have seen. That said, there is no excuse for belittling others for legitimate upsets that have happened at the hands of this Merchant who has deplorable business practices.

Again, I have a recorded telephone conversation, and a great number of email exchanges between us that will easily point out the things I have referenced.

This Artisan has admitted mistakes to me from the first order I have made. I've made five or six. I'd have to count them. Each time he admitted mistakes. At what point are they simply going to be corrected to where there need be no more admissions of mistakes?

That he has admitted mistakes would be fine if they weren't continually repeated... the same ones.

Rather than suggest what I do, how about you suggest that businesses be responsible with their customers. That would be a good start.

And rather than suggest I do anything, how about you simply do what you think is best for you. You will have zero influence on what I think is best for me. I am a pretty nice guy all things considered. But lie to me enough, fail to follow through on your word on every single interaction we have, lie to me repeatedly and you will find that I stop being quite so nice. Maybe you're a better man than me if that's not how you would respond as well.

Let me suggest that you keep your nose firmly planted in your own business. You and I have no business together.

Mohammed is a very likable guy. And he produces a great product. I will buy it or not as I see fit in the future. And if I do buy it, I probably will not elect to buy from his website but I would instead buy from a reputable vendor that he supplies. That way I am sure to get the order precisely as expected.

Telling this to a group of people who Could well be in for a very significant surprise as they find their orders don't get delivered as promised, is precisely one of the reasons these forums exist. They do not exist simply to kiss the back sides of every Artisan.

Feel free to ask Mohammed yourself, he and I got along very well. I accepted his apologies at every step. When I finally discovered that he didn't feel responsible for these issues and that they were continuing with every single launch, I decided that I would say my truth.

And my truth is simple the product is great but the business practices behind the product will probably leave you disappointed. Or at least they could well leave you disappointed if they continue on as they have.

That is not being overly negative. It is simply saying the truth.

I was very willing to be done with this until you wrote. Perhaps you should let this lie. You will gain nothing by continuing it.

And the only thing that I wish to gain is to be the voice of reason pointing out issues and discrepancies from the past. Each of us must make our own decision. And it's hard to make a decision when one doesn't know what they're facing.

I will also give credit where credit's due. If I see that release dates are being met, and products are delivered as promised, I will be the first person to also back this change up and be supportive. I really do like Mohammed. And I really will not tolerate deceptive business practices that can hurt people here.

You seem to want it all one way.  You try to invalidate anyone's opinion but your own.  You have insulted me.

You are attempting to bludgeon anyone whose opinion differs from yours.  Also, it has not been one person but several who disagree with you.  Again, I do not disagree with your unhappiness with promises made, and you may, indeed, be correct as far as what you have experienced.  However, others have not experienced what you have or they are willing to accept the missteps of Mohammad.  That, in no way, makes them "shills" so please stop putting them down.  Once again, your wallet is, by far, your best mouthpiece.

You can choose to feel offended if that is your choice. It was not my intention to offend you. And for the life of me I can't figure out how you could possibly be offended by what I've said to you. Sensitive much?

Offering my opinion of what happened in no way put anyone down. The shill I was referring to has indeed acted as such. That is not you. So why are you even mentioning it?

Whether someone wants to accept the realities of this situation or simply see the positive side that they are spinning, is certainly up to them. Just as it's up to me to determine if that is real or not and then to State my opinion. I've done that.

Perhaps it's time for you to move on now. If that's what you would like me to do, do that as well. Of course, I will wait for a response and if I get one, I will respond to it.

And no, I don't want anything both ways. I have never said that. That's your spin. I have simply said the truth as it affected me. I have not elaborated, in fact I have downplayed what actually happened. I think the truth is important. Whether you would like to focus on one thing at the exclusion of others is certainly up to you. If that's the case, ignore my messages.

And I have little reason to continue writing. Unless you do. Then I will respond. You see, you too don't get to have it both ways. You can't attack me and think I'm not going to respond.

How about you simply drop this. I will if you will. But if anyone responds to me, I will respond back. Deal?

And one thing I do promise... If I see the same behavior from this artisan, I will in fact shout it from the Tree Tops. And I hope you will join me. All of us deserve honorable businesses to buy from.

You have your wish, sir. You and I are done.

This post is not addressed to the "wronged guy" so lets move on....

I have not bought any of the GD soaps yet but keep hearing a lot of good things about them.

Could you all please share two of his best scents that are in production and readily available, One vegan and one Tallow to help me decide which ones to pick.

For me, I'd say Chypre Conifere (vegan base but with donkey milk) and Mallard (although that's duck fat, not tallow).

I haven't tried Angel though, which seems to be much appreciated. And there's three new Mallard scents coming...

You seem to want it all one way.  You try to invalidate anyone's opinion but your own.  You have insulted me.

You are attempting to bludgeon anyone whose opinion differs from yours.  Also, it has not been one person but several who disagree with you.  Again, I do not disagree with your unhappiness with promises made, and you may, indeed, be correct as far as what you have experienced.  However, others have not experienced what you have or they are willing to accept the missteps of Mohammad.  That, in no way, makes them "shills" so please stop putting them down.  Once again, your wallet is, by far, your best mouthpiece.

You can choose to feel offended if that is your choice. It was not my intention to offend you. And for the life of me I can't figure out how you could possibly be offended by what I've said to you. Sensitive much?

Offering my opinion of what happened in no way put anyone down. The shill I was referring to has indeed acted as such. That is not you. So why are you even mentioning it?

Whether someone wants to accept the realities of this situation or simply see the positive side that they are spinning, is certainly up to them. Just as it's up to me to determine if that is real or not and then to State my opinion. I've done that.

Perhaps it's time for you to move on now. If that's what you would like me to do, do that as well. Of course, I will wait for a response and if I get one, I will respond to it.

And no, I don't want anything both ways. I have never said that. That's your spin. I have simply said the truth as it affected me. I have not elaborated, in fact I have downplayed what actually happened. I think the truth is important. Whether you would like to focus on one thing at the exclusion of others is certainly up to you. If that's the case, ignore my messages.

And I have little reason to continue writing. Unless you do. Then I will respond. You see, you too don't get to have it both ways. You can't attack me and think I'm not going to respond.

How about you simply drop this. I will if you will. But if anyone responds to me, I will respond back. Deal?

And one thing I do promise... If I see the same behavior from this artisan, I will in fact shout it from the Tree Tops. And I hope you will join me. All of us deserve honorable businesses to buy from.

You have your wish, sir.  You and I are done.

Thank you. Couldn't imagine a better outcome.

Well I could imagine one better outcome... we could all get along. Which would certainly be my wish.

Let me just state that if I offended you, I apologize. It was not my intention. I've stated my intention numerous times so won't do it again in this message.

I respect each of our rights to opine. That is what these forums are for. I don't believe mine is better than anyone else's. When someone tries to tell me over and over that it isn't a big deal if businesses don't do as promised... that's not ok with me. And I will stand up for what I think. We all should.

In any event, it was not my intention to offend you. And that said, I am not one to back down. I will give you (and everyone) your right to state your opinion and will expect the same in return. Being honorable is a BIG deal to me. I wish it was to everyone.

Let me also say for the record, I like Mohammad. He and I got along very well until I had enough of the same. Still, he was always very kind and respectful to me. As I was to him. I did a lot to help him.

Maybe another day and time, we would get along just fine. I hope so.

Shaving is an art best enjoyed by gentlemen. I hope this is a step in that direction.

This post is not addressed to the "wronged guy" so lets move on....

I have not bought any of the GD soaps yet but keep hearing a lot of good things about them.

Could you all please share two of his best scents that are in production and readily available, One vegan and one Tallow to help me decide which ones to pick.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I have two Grooming Dept soaps, Mallard and Magnolia. They're both wonderful Mallard is in the duck tallow base and Magnolia I believe is vegan and they are both outstanding. I'm looking forward to trying more of these soaps, a beef tallow for sure and that lamb tallow sounds nice too. I don't think you can go wrong with any of these soaps.

My favorite scent so far is Mallard. Forgot what base is that, duck most probably.

Second favorite would be Lavender, but that’s not available anymore.

I have one...we could chat. Haha

Love mallard for skin tesults, less than interested in scent. Voyage, conca, chypre, yuzu, ambra more appealing to me if it matters.

On another note.....I will be using Mohammad’s wonderful creation - After The Fire - tomorrow morning and I can Hardly wait.



Let’s just relax and have some fun.

Dinder1 that is such a great shot and an excellent combination! I’ve been using GD After The Fire with B&M Reserve Cool as well as Chatillon Lux Clamorgan, a couple of awesome Barbershop type Aftershaves! Enjoy!

On another note.....I will be using Mohammad’s wonderful creation - After The Fire - tomorrow morning and I can Hardly wait.



Let’s just relax and have some fun.

Dinder1 that is such a great shot and an excellent combination! I’ve been using GD After The Fire with B&M Reserve Cool as well as Chatillon Lux Clamorgan, a couple of awesome Barbershop type Aftershaves! Enjoy!

Thank you TheHunter the Floid Blue is really a nice pairing with this soap. Your aftershave choices would be awesome too!