ETHOS Grooming Essentials A New Line

TrumptUp I believe if you would read my statement I said everyone has the right to express their opinion about the product. The line is crossed when you attack a person, that is bullying and should be unacceptable to any human being

Really tempted to stay out of this BUT hate seeing a guy get the business even if he has opportunities for improvement.

Fact of the matter is that this has nothing to do with Sebum in any way as ETHOS is magnitudes less expensive than Sebum in any product one might want to compare - they really aren't competitors for the same market to my perspective. Sebum is targeted at the market of guys proud to have paid outrageous amounts of money.  That market does exist as anybody having been involved with Lamborghini, Ferrari or Ducati can tell you - there a lot of guys buying things so people know they can afford to spend that kind of money even if they derive no incremental benefit.  In the case of Lamborghini, Ferrari and Ducati solely because the overwhelming majority of buyers have no driving/rider skill even if competing in such series as Challenge and Tropheo - not ALL BUT overwhelmingly nearly all.  Hell Asians in particular seem to take great pride in overpaying as a cultural badge of honour (beloved Dad was Asian so no racism in that).

Having perhaps the singularly worst skin of anybody encountered online, can flatly state NOTHING has worked better re shaving products - that just a fact; between a relationship with the single most experienced soap expert online and having since handled a massive PIF for those in dire straits, have tried all the soaps mentioned on various fora.  The EOS complex - whatever in the Hell it is - makes a marked difference to my skin; empirically know this as Frank has conducted blind trials with every successful outcome coming down to EOS and 1 other ingredient that won't be mentioned but is identified on the labels explicitly.

Finally, regarding scent: it is quite the hurdle to suggest any house copying other houses is less than honourable as they all do it - from Creed to Roja to Skin Bracer - there really is very very little truly unique under the Sun regarding scent AND when Frank has explicitly copied, it is because customers have affirmatively requested he mimic a scent out of production or available in an inferiour inexpensively priced base.  Is it creative - NO but is it dishonourable - think not.

That is my take on those particular aspects of the ETHOS business model, not that it any of my damned business, same could be stated of my perspectives on Sebum, Lamborghini, Ferrari or Ducati for that matter.  

Your comment underscore my additional point. Unless that EOS complex is fragrance, he is in violation of the United States FDA rules on labeling ingredients for cosmetics. I ask again, is this something someone with 28 years of experience would do knowingly?

As a former Fortune 50 Jr Exec charged with major programmes launch and turnaround, I would call it EOS as an ingredient, then fight to the bowels of bloody living Hell to preserve its trade secrecy - in essence force the regulators to press the issue if inclined to go after a small fish in an ocean of manufacturers much larger with more publicity value for political ends.

But again, it none of my business how Frank nor anybody else addresses such issues excepting as it concerns general public policy

Your comment underscore my additional point. Unless that EOS complex is fragrance, he is in violation of the United States FDA rules on labeling ingredients for cosmetics. I ask again, is this something someone with 28 years of experience would do knowingly?

As a former Fortune 50 Jr Exec charged with major programmes launch and turnaround, I would call it EOS as an ingredient, then fight to the bowels of bloody living Hell to preserve its trade secrecy - in essence force the regulators to press the issue if inclined to go after a small fish in an ocean of manufacturers much larger with more publicity value for political ends.

But again, it none of my business how Frank nor anybody else addresses such issues excepting as it concerns general public policy

EOS is widely advertised as 26 separate ingredients. You cannot claim trade secret protection in an ingredients list. The rule is very clear, the only time you can do this is with fragrance and then it must be listed as fragrance. The rule and its exception are clear and unambiguous.

'Fragrance featuring EOS' or 'EOS enhanced fragrance' has magically just become a scent enhancer and the ingredients dispense with any mention of EOS using it only as a marketing descriptor in the general labeling of MY illustrative business model; can not nor do not claim to speak for ETHOS.

TrumptUp what's the point of your posts? just about every single shaving soap maker in our niche makes a dupe of popular fragrances.

also, having made a custom scent with Frank now and smelling a fair amount in his lineup, his offerings are usually pretty different than the originals - success and colonia, to name 2.

TrumptUp what's the point of your posts?  just about every single shaving soap maker in our niche makes a dupe of popular fragrances.

My point initially was to discuss copying, then I had a question about the labeling of ingredients, which is a perfectly fair question. I haven't violated any rules, as some here have suggested.

are you posting in other soap makers threads to ask them too? I'm just curious..

My point initially was to discuss copying, then I had a question about the labeling of ingredients, which is a perfectly fair question. I haven't violated any rules, as some here have suggested.

are you posting in other soap makers threads to ask them too?  I'm just curious..

To ask them what? This is the first time I have seen an example of a blatant violation on the rules related to listing ingredients. DragonsBeard sat here viewing this thread for the better part of an hour just now and never responded. I am curious as to what his response might be.

to ask them why they make a copy/dupe of some popular fragrance. stop it, you know what you're doing here.

send a PM to Frank if you have questions, this isn't even a thread he created.

To ask them what? This is the first time I have seen an example of a blatant violation on the rules related to listing ingredients. DragonsBeard sat here viewing this thread for the better part of an hour just now and never responded. I am curious as to what his response might be.

to ask them why they make a copy/dupe of some popular fragrance.  stop it, you know what you're doing here.

send a PM to Frank if you have questions, this isn't even a thread he created.

I may have done in the past. I don't understand why Frank cannot respond here as to my question about the ingredients. I also don't understand why I cannot discuss more than one thing at a time. My question is perfectly valid and people interested in his products have a right to know the ingredients are labeled in a complaint manner. What is the harm in him responding??? And why the hostility? Again, I bring up a possible negative and it's as if I am trying to burn the shop down. Where is the fairness in that?

go troll somewhere else. just about every single post you made on DFS has been to complain or nag about something.

All I’m going t say is this anyone, anytime who has any questions about my products or what goes in them just email me. I’m easy to get a hold of as many , many of my customers know.

Oh and he’s wrong on the FDA info as there are things called patents and trade secrets that the FDA recognizes. .

He obviously has an agenda and I’m pretty sure I know where it’s coming from as many people have called or texted me on this person.

I’m pretty busy now but I’m going to do a post in the very near future about how I approach crrating a aroma blend.

Frank this person is not worth your time or energy, review his few posts he has and you will find most of them are only to attack others. He has a right to an opinion but as you can see, the majority of posters find it blatantly useless. People like this only thrive on stirring up trouble.

Where is the constructive conversation here ? As grandma said if you have nothing nice to say then the wisest thing may be not to say anything at all. Can we get back to the thread and ignore the nonsense and comical interlude (yup my tinfoil hat is back on).

So let me put it out there in the spirit of the original poster. I for one am looking forward to this "Bean" scent as the Vanilla Safi has performed stellarly so far (and yes I do not have all the scent nor do I like every one). I have tried others but the ETHOS products, for me, are a cut above (that means it works better than even more expensive brands and you all can take a guess but I will not name them as I will not bash other products). I also am very excited for the upcoming "Blood Orange" and I think it may be even more "interesting".