DE vs SE

New razors and blades aren't autoclaved.  Who knows what the heck kind of filth they may have come into contact with in those factories in China, India, Israel, Russia or down the street  

Theres a difference between sanitized and sterilized, you really only need sanitized.  Things that are sterilized will only remain so for a brief period, the world is full of bugs and stuff looking to live on something...or someone   I learned a lot about this back when I was a home brewer - you're aiming for sanitized not sterilized. I think its the same with razors - there's probably more stuff living on your face than on that ebay razor you're reluctant to buy.

I agree that there is difference between sterile and sanitary. For most things sanitary is sufficient. But for practices that could lead to blood and body fluid exposure sterile is required. When you have your blood drawn the needle used is a single use item. It is disposed. It is not washed in some dawn dish soap and reused. Why? Because blood born pathogens are a serious problem. Viruses such as Hepatitis C can live on surfaces for several months if they are not properly cleaned and sterilized. I am an Orthopaedic surgeon and know the effort that goes into sterilizing surgical instruments. Yes...part of the reason for the sterilization process is to minimize the chance for a post operative bacterial infection. But, it is also to protect patients from blood borne pathogens like HIV and Hepatitis B&C.  I simply am not willing to take the chance. Perhaps others are.

False. According to the U.S. Centers for Disease Control and Prevention, HCV can survive on environmental surfaces at room temperature for at least 16 hours but no longer than four days. The HIV virus can only live on surfaces for several hours.

That is not accurate. HCV can live on surfaces for several weeks.

Let's be clear. If people choose to use previously owned razors there is a small chance of blood borne pathogen transmission. If you are comfortable with that risk, fine. I am not.

https://www.cdc.gov/hepatitis/hcv/cfaq.htm#cFAQ36

(From CDC website)

How long does the Hepatitis C virus survive outside the body?

The Hepatitis C virus can survive outside the body at room temperature, on environmental surfaces, for up to 3 weeks.

Personally, I am thankful to OP for bringing this up.

I am certain this will generate disagreement...but I will not use a previously owned razor.  Unless they are run through an autoclave they will not be properly sterilized.

-Mark

New razors and blades aren't autoclaved.  Who knows what the heck kind of filth they may have come into contact with in those factories in China, India, Israel, Russia or down the street  

Theres a difference between sanitized and sterilized, you really only need sanitized.  Things that are sterilized will only remain so for a brief period, the world is full of bugs and stuff looking to live on something...or someone   I learned a lot about this back when I was a home brewer - you're aiming for sanitized not sterilized. I think its the same with razors - there's probably more stuff living on your face than on that ebay razor you're reluctant to buy.

I agree that there is difference between sterile and sanitary. For most things sanitary is sufficient. But for practices that could lead to blood and body fluid exposure sterile is required. When you have your blood drawn the needle used is a single use item. It is disposed. It is not washed in some dawn dish soap and reused. Why? Because blood born pathogens are a serious problem. Viruses such as Hepatitis C can live on surfaces for several months if they are not properly cleaned and sterilized. I am an Orthopaedic surgeon and know the effort that goes into sterilizing surgical instruments. Yes...part of the reason for the sterilization process is to minimize the chance for a post operative bacterial infection. But, it is also to protect patients from blood borne pathogens like HIV and Hepatitis B&C.  I simply am not willing to take the chance. Perhaps others are.

Mark, I for one am quite happy that hospitals/surgeons go to such lengths to sterilize their instruments. That is one area where my risk tolerance is very low - having undergone 4 orthopaedic procedures, all successful and without any post-op infections of any kind I am grateful for the extreme lengths taken in the interests of patient safety.

While you certainly raise good points, when it comes to shaving one's face, we all accept greater or lesser amounts of risk. I have a few vintage razors that I believe between my efforts to clean them, the replating process most have undergone and the passage of time, likely present a low risk of infection. I disassemble and rinse all parts/blade after each shave and dry everything out and I regularly wash with dish soap and a toothbrush to remove soap scum etc. I wouldn't think of sharing a razor or a blade with anybody but thats another matter altogether - kind of gross like sharing a toothbrush.

I saw an article recently that indicated that persons who groom their pubic regions have a statistically higher incidence of STDs. It wasn't a particularly scientific study and didn't get into whether it was that such people are more promiscuous than the more hirsute among us or whether the closely groomed skin that one might find in the case of a brazilian bikini wax may in some way compromise the skin barrier allowing pathogens an easier way in. I wonder if razor sharers might exhibit higher incidence of facial irritation/infection (FTDs)

Stop the paranoia already.

HCV (hepatitis C) can survive on environmental surfaces at room temperature for at least 16 hours but no longer than four days. The HIV virus can only live on surfaces for several hours.

So unless you're sharing you personal grooming tools with an HCV+ or HIV+ person and you're having unprotected sex with black market razors and blades that you bought in a brothel run by the Russian mob, you have nothing to worry about.

Stop the paranoia already.

HCV (hepatitis C) can survive on environmental surfaces at room temperature for at least 16 hours but no longer than four days. The HIV virus can only live on surfaces for several hours.

So unless you're sharing you personal grooming tools with an HCV+ or HIV+ person and you're having unprotected sex with black market razors and blades that you bought in a brothel run by the Russian mob, you have nothing to worry about.

And who doesn't clean/disinfect their vintage razors when they get them? It's not like hospitals have exclusive access to effective disinfectant. I'm baffled by the gentleman's post. Like I said he can refrain from the vintage acquisition hobby but facts is facts when it comes to the actual risks presented.

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Stop the paranoia already.

HCV (hepatitis C) can survive on environmental surfaces at room temperature for at least 16 hours but no longer than four days. The HIV virus can only live on surfaces for several hours.

So unless you're sharing you personal grooming tools with an HCV+ or HIV+ person and you're having unprotected sex with black market razors and blades that you bought in a brothel run by the Russian mob, you have nothing to worry about.

Stop the paranoia already.

HCV (hepatitis C) can survive on environmental surfaces at room temperature for at least 16 hours but no longer than four days. The HIV virus can only live on surfaces for several hours.

So unless you're sharing you personal grooming tools with an HCV+ or HIV+ person and you're having unprotected sex with black market razors and blades that you bought in a brothel run by the Russian mob, you have nothing to worry about.

And who doesn't clean/disinfect their vintage razors when they get them? It's not like hospitals have exclusive access to effective disinfectant. I'm baffled by the gentleman's post. Like I said he can refrain from the vintage acquisition hobby but facts is facts when it comes to the actual risks presented.

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This disagreement is futile. You are welcome to your opinion and I am welcome to mine.

So...without further ado...let's continue the conversation about SE vs. DE.

Stop the paranoia already.

HCV (hepatitis C) can survive on environmental surfaces at room temperature for at least 16 hours but no longer than four days. The HIV virus can only live on surfaces for several hours.

So unless you're sharing you personal grooming tools with an HCV+ or HIV+ person and you're having unprotected sex with black market razors and blades that you bought in a brothel run by the Russian mob, you have nothing to worry about.

And who doesn't clean/disinfect their vintage razors when they get them? It's not like hospitals have exclusive access to effective disinfectant. I'm baffled by the gentleman's post. Like I said he can refrain from the vintage acquisition hobby but facts is facts when it comes to the actual risks presented.

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Oh well. He acknowledges he is missing out on the vast segment of razors available to him and he is fine with that. That is why I pointed out you(we) arent going to change anyones mind over the internet when their mind is already made up. I have read extensively on germophobic Obsessive Compulsive Disorders. If it can take a man 3 hours and 3 bars of soap to take one daily shower, the mere thought of someone else's bodily fluid possibly touch or mixing with their own would be catastrophic.

A better opening post for this thread should read;

"I hear SEs are great for shaving. Please compare and contrast new production DEs and SEs with direct knowledge from their use. I refuse to touch or use any shave items that have been used by any other humanoid primate. My interest is in new items I can buy directly from the manufacturer with possible CNC metal shavings and machine oil."

I can abide that. Since I really dont use any modern production razors, thus I dont have any direct knowledge, thus I wont give advice to someone that already has their mind made up against my advice because he never advised us of his limitations 5 pages ago.





So if you will now excuse me. I need to go disinfect my boar brush. I'll be damned if I am going to get ringworm just because I use it to shave.

Stop the paranoia already.

HCV (hepatitis C) can survive on environmental surfaces at room temperature for at least 16 hours but no longer than four days. The HIV virus can only live on surfaces for several hours.

So unless you're sharing you personal grooming tools with an HCV+ or HIV+ person and you're having unprotected sex with black market razors and blades that you bought in a brothel run by the Russian mob, you have nothing to worry about.

You say that like its a bad thing.

Ever heard of Barbicide?

I, for one, will never buy a used brush. It seems grosser to me. Hair is an absorbent material thus being harder to clean or disinfect whereas razors are made of metal. Any contaminants can be easily removed. Just my 2 cents...

So in the next week or so I will actually use for the first time a SE razor and will therefore have a frame of reference for comparing the SE vs DE experience. I will report back at that time.