why do people get banned at shaving sites?

On the other site, I was actually lectured by an admin for being excessively analytical (I kid you not).

Why have a forum if analysis is discouraged? "It's just soap" translates to its just razors, brushes, blades and splashes.

Very unfortunate!

They want analysis, but only one-sided analysis in favor products from certain brands (that are favored paid vendors). Anything else is "trolling".

When Bruce was banned for defending a vendor I knew he was better off. Back in the beginning in early 2012 it was an easy going shaving forum. Most of the present mods/admins were either just members or probably had not heard of the forum at that point. Some were not even wet shaving yet.

NeoXerxes didn't do anything wrong beyond posting a lot about quality soaps he (and others) were interested in testing/purchasing. The SN has developed a lot of drama of late...something I don't even notice on B&B.

Yep. I posted about and reviewed plenty of soaps and never had an issue nor accusation of bias. It was not until I made an unfavorable observation about a soap from a paid vendor that I had a problem.

Oh, I am with you. If you are going to review a product for others to make a baseline decision, I want you to be as thorough as possible. I rather read a good opinion than a half%$& one

Hehe, agreed .

It happened to me with a brush maker, so I know how you feel. I left on my own accord because this is not important enough for me to get aggravated by people that I don't even know. All I can do is laugh about it and move on.

I understand that approach, however forums are more than simply opinions posted on the internet. They are communities of like-minded people who are converge around the same hobby. When an unaccountable group of tyrannical thugs takes it upon themselves to permanently exile a member of the community because their opinion differs, it's offensive to me. I might laugh because it is petty and embarrassing that one opinion can be such a threat, but it's still offensive.

All of us should remember that there are human beings behind these scattered words. The ability to speak and offer contrary opinions is something that should be protected.

I completely understand. I used to feel the same way about the community until a few people that I thought were my friends, stabbed me in the back. Once that happened, I lost all type of trust and faith in the "community" thing. That's why I see this for what it is and not for what I wish it would be.

Don't get me wrong, it is unfortunate, but it is what it is. Plus, I am not a friendly person anyway

I know that beneath that gruff exterior (of what looks to be a shirtless Teddy Roosevelt), there is a cuddly little teddy bear that just wants to be loved . Hehe.

*Cues motivational speech music and waves flag of cooperation and universal brotherhood*: We can make this forum what you wish it would be! Per aspera ad astra!

In all seriousness though, community isn't always organic - it has to be carefully cultivated. I'm convinced that this can be done here better than elsewhere simply because the forum is more open. If the powers that be on DFS are listening, please keep the forum a place where open discussion is not only tolerated, but encouraged. That's a great model that should be upheld by all parties involved.

PS: I'm convinced that unwarranted banning and other forms of censorship emerge from a deep-seated sense of insecurity. It is nice to see that this sort of abuse is condemned here.

Completely agree hrfdez! That's why I was careful to use the word "unwarranted" . Some folks can't figure out how to be respectful even after warnings. In general though, exiling a member of a community is quite a serious punishment, and should be applied proportionately and in a responsible manner.

Opinions differing or negative reviews being given on a paid vendor's product are obviously not appropriate reasons for a ban.

I was banned from the Shavenook for "trolling" (literally, a permanent ban with a single word explanation). Anyone who knows me and my posts should realize how ridiculous that charge is.

As for the actual reason, I suspect it was two things: First, I made a negative observation about a paying vendor that is favored by the mods (one of their mods called this observation "trolling", and literally explained that my analytical way of reviewing was a problem), and gave a positive review to Barrister & Mann's Night Music; second, I made a call for free discussion without bias from the mods/admins, observing that their moderation team selectively moderates certain posts positively and shuts down others quickly, depending on whether or not the vendor pays them. I had quite a few private messages from members asking what one of their admins had against me personally in order to treat me as he did.

Very suspicious site. I find it hilarious that the mods/admins maintain this authority by simply stating that they don't give reasons for why members are banned. Convenient, ain't it?

And honestly, vendors should take this into account when they advertise on sites like TSN. Consider this: If you give money knowingly to a site that is practically one big advertisement masquerading as a forum (a forum that bans people indiscriminately), you're indirectly contributing to their shady practices. When members see admins/moderators bullying members for holding contrary opinions, or shutting down threads and banning members on trumped up charges, they are smart enough to realize that the site is compromised and its posts have no credibility. People aren't stupid.

I am sorry for your experience. I got into a run in with a vendor over on the same forum. The topic was price per shave vis-a-vis overall cost of the soap. I commented on two soaps, one was MdC and the other, which I will not mention, is an extremely popular soap on that site. I said something to the effect that I thought I could get X amount of soaps from MdC and X from the unnamed soap. That's when the vendor jumped in and said that my facts were all wrong etc. etc. I felt bullied and eventually apologized. In retrospect I should NOT have mentioned that vendor's soap, it was a mistake and I acknowledge that, but the bullying was uncalled for and has since soured my opinion of the Nook. Too bad, because I was really enjoying the site. Don't see that here on DFS, so thanks to the mods for keeping that in check.

This is a very interesting thread and one I have never seen openly discussed on any other shaving forum.

And you won't my friend. It would be shut down in a blink of an eye.

Well celestino and CHSeifert, I, for one, am thrilled to have both of you, AND you unique perspectives, here to contribute to the conversation.

And I would add that I am happy to see two great contributors to our hobby here also. Welcome Claus and Celestino.

I am sorry for your experience. I got into a run in with a vendor over on the same forum. The topic was price per shave vis-a-vis overall cost of the soap. I commented on two soaps, one was MdC and the other, which I will not mention, is an extremely popular soap on that site. I said something to the effect that I thought I could get X amount of soaps from MdC and X from the unnamed soap. That's when the vendor jumped in and said that my facts were all wrong etc. etc. I felt bullied and eventually apologized. In retrospect I should NOT have mentioned that vendor's soap, it was a mistake and I acknowledge that, but the bullying was uncalled for and has since soured my opinion of the Nook. Too bad, because I was really enjoying the site. Don't see that here on DFS, so thanks to the mods for keeping that in check.

Primo, you've always struck me as a gentleman, but I'm blown away by the magnanimity of your apology. That wasn't your mistake at all - you were merely expressing your opinion on the value of the soap relative to MdC. I've made similar comparisons (both with soap and with fragrance), and that doesn't warrant bullying by a vendor. Nor should the vendor have taken it so personally.

I wonder if that particular soap was the same one that earned me such a fiery reaction from a certain admin.

Oh, I am with you.  If you are going to review a product for others to make a baseline decision, I want you to be as thorough as possible. I rather read a good opinion than a half%$& one

Hehe, agreed .

It happened to me with a brush maker, so I know how you feel.  I left on my own accord because this is not important enough for me to get aggravated by people that I don't even know.  All I can do is laugh about it and move on.

I understand that approach, however forums are more than simply opinions posted on the internet. They are communities of like-minded people who are converge around the same hobby. When an unaccountable group of tyrannical thugs takes it upon themselves to permanently exile a member of the community because their opinion differs, it's offensive to me. I might laugh because it is petty and embarrassing that one opinion can be such a threat, but it's still offensive.

All of us should remember that there are human beings behind these scattered words. The ability to speak and offer contrary opinions is something that should be protected.

Well said.

Oh, I am with you.  If you are going to review a product for others to make a baseline decision, I want you to be as thorough as possible. I rather read a good opinion than a half%$& one

Hehe, agreed .

It happened to me with a brush maker, so I know how you feel.  I left on my own accord because this is not important enough for me to get aggravated by people that I don't even know.  All I can do is laugh about it and move on.

I understand that approach, however forums are more than simply opinions posted on the internet. They are communities of like-minded people who are converge around the same hobby. When an unaccountable group of tyrannical thugs takes it upon themselves to permanently exile a member of the community because their opinion differs, it's offensive to me. I might laugh because it is petty and embarrassing that one opinion can be such a threat, but it's still offensive.

All of us should remember that there are human beings behind these scattered words. The ability to speak and offer contrary opinions is something that should be protected.

I am sorry for your experience. I got into a run in with a vendor over on the same forum. The topic was price per shave vis-a-vis overall cost of the soap. I commented on two soaps, one was MdC and the other, which I will not mention, is an extremely popular soap on that site. I said something to the effect that I thought I could get X amount of soaps from MdC and X from the unnamed soap. That's when the vendor jumped in and said that my facts were all wrong etc. etc. I felt bullied and eventually apologized. In retrospect I should NOT have mentioned that vendor's soap, it was a mistake and I acknowledge that, but the bullying was uncalled for and has since soured my opinion of the Nook. Too bad, because I was really enjoying the site. Don't see that here on DFS, so thanks to the mods for keeping that in check.

Primo, you've always struck me as a gentleman, but I'm blown away by the magnanimity of your apology. That wasn't your mistake at all - you were merely expressing your opinion on the value of the soap relative to MdC. I've made similar comparisons (both with soap and with fragrance), and that doesn't warrant bullying by a vendor. Nor should the vendor have taken it so personally.

I wonder if that particular soap was the same one that earned me such a fiery reaction from a certain admin.

Thank you for that compliment. No, it was a different soap that uses four letters as it's acronym, if you will. I was a newbie, I was trying to be a part of the community. I literally feared banning, it was that abusive. Afterwards, a mod, on the forum, not via PM, told me that we all make mistakes sometimes. Now, almost two years later and almost 4000 posts on the three forums that I frequent, I chuckle at my naïveté. I would further laud DFS for providing a safe environment for its members to share freely---without fear of reproach, their opinions.