Venting on vendors

This would have been deleted in a New York second over at that Skunk & Shaver site.

Yeah, you don't dare cross the hall monitors' gentlemanly sensibilities over at the Twerk & Jerk.

There has been some debate over whether or not it's a requirement to list the ingredients in the US. The language the FDA uses regarding soap would seem to imply that it's regarding soap used for cleansing and that shaving soap does not fall into that category. However, since it was never explicitly stated and it's unlikely that the FDA would ever pursue it on such a small scale, it's left up to the creator.

That said, I do agree with your sentiments. I would not use a soap/product that didn't list its ingredients by weight (in either form).

Fragrances can be very difficult to describe. You can choose basic descriptors like composition notes, family, etc. and/or you can talk about the inspiration for the scent. The latter is what seems to rustle people's jimmies.

This would have been deleted in a New York second over at that Skunk & Shaver site.

Yeah, you don't dare cross the hall monitors' gentlemanly sensibilities over at the Twerk & Jerk.

Now thats funny right there. They are a big target and have slighted so many people, I bet their enemies are as numerous as their faithful gentlemanly followers. (sorry...... dry heave)


I agree with Chris that all soaps need to list their ingredient list whether or not the product implies or states a specific benefit. ie moisturizing, heal faster etc.


I also agree with Chris that a scent description should be as simple and to the the point as possible. I could care less about the name.

I would like to add that from a soapers point af view, a scent description is an avenue for salesmanship. So they have to create the setting to imply the scent. The better the description, the better the sales pitch, the better odds for a sale. This is especially true with complex scents. I have racked my brain and tried to describe Hallows in 1-3 words. Impossible. It takes many words to relate a laypersons experiences to what a scent may be like.

But I still lean with Chris. Give me a one or two word scent profile. Creamsicle. Lemon. Vanilla. Fruitloops. Mountain Dew. Fresh-cut grass. Hot apple-cider. Camp-fire.

I still cant describe what a fougere is without just saying green fern. Simplicity has its advantages. But I dont need a scent pyramid or a poem.

Technically, as a soap, there is no ingredient requirement, unless it is touted as being a moisturizer, conditioner, or some other such hygiene specialty item. Soap does not require an ingredients list, which is why Proctor & Gamble can make New Wave Whistle-Clean "Pure" Green Friendly soap and never tell you which cleansing chemicals are being used...

I do, however, agree with scent descriptions. I'm not a fan of the overly poetic, nostalgic claims that I will feel like a New Man on an Old Beach with a tropical drink and sexy Senorita. I don't care. Is it coconut or pineapple? I don't need to know that a mahogany library lined with 100 year old books smells the same as this new soap. Is it tobacco, spice, or leather?

It's tough to blame vendors and artisans for not revealing their core ingredients. Soaps are very proprietary, and revealing the ingredients list could cause issues for a small vendor or artisan. It's really difficult to say an artisan should bite the bullet and reveal their ingredients despite a lack of requirements in this case. They need to protect the differences between their "best new soap" and Soapmaker B's "best new soap"...

My suggestion...if you are curious due to specific allergies or requirements...ask. If you know what you are trying to avoid, it's easy enough to ask the vendor or maker...

I hear you, I don't mind the artisan using some poetic description in line with their branding/marketing strategy as long as they tell you somewhere what it smells like or is supposed to smell like - they don't need to disclose the EOs used or any of that but like you said, is it coconut or pineapple? Even worse is the soapers that do tell you what the soap is supposed to smell like and when you open it and stick your nose in the tub you're hard pressed to detect any scent whatsoever. I've posted about a couple of those previously and won't re-open that worm can. They know who they are.

Marko, peoples sniffers are incredibly diverse. Some folks are scent sensitive and others are pretty much scent dead. I know that's what I found when I tested my scents. I tried for too strong for my nose and pretty much that's what the consensus was among others when it hit the streets. Of course lathering, a sort of dilution, tamed it. I'm extremely sensitive to synthetic scents (I can't tolerate them, more so when fresh) but less so for the real stuff.

Marko, peoples sniffers are incredibly diverse. Some folks are scent sensitive and others are pretty much scent dead. I know that's what I found when I tested my scents. I tried for too strong for my nose and pretty much that's what the consensus was among others when it hit the streets. Of course lathering, a sort of dilution, tamed it. I'm extremely sensitive to synthetic scents (I can't tolerate them, more so when fresh) but less so for the real stuff.

Brian, thats true and if you read the feedback on various soaps you'll see comments on scent strength all over the map for the same soaps. I guess we'll never know unless we had everyone sniffing the same tub whether its them or the soap. I don't think I'm scent dead but scent is very important to me. It doesn't have to hit me over the head as I am able to appreciate subtlety and nuance but when you get 2 soaps from a maker one called Bay rum and the other sandalwood and you can't tell the difference between them there's a problem. So I suppose in the interest of YMMV and that there's something for everyone in the wet shaving world, some products will appeal to those who like light scent and some will appeal to those who like heavy scent. The soap makers should do us the courtesy of informing us which category their soaps fall in to.

I didn't write what I wrote to refute your comment, only to share another outlook. In that vein, many folks have no idea what bay rum should smell like since it's been such a perverted scent by many manufacturers.

But to get back to noses, my Frostbite was found in testing to have few people to detect the major scents involved. But everyone could detect at least one. The majority of testers were in that latter category.

Interesting thread, let's stay on topic so it can play out.

I agree. this can be a very cordial thread if people don't start bashing other shaving sites.

with that out of the way...I find it incredibly annoying when someone doesn't list their ingredients used. it's more work for a merchant to have to respond to emails asking what's in the soap or product when they can just list it directly on their site 1 time and be done with it.

my wife makes lip balm for some friends & family during the Christmas season. she even takes the time to list the ingredients on the labels she prints out..

In high school, a weekend ritual was the local swap meet at the drive in. A poster table sold Easy Rider, Beatles and Jimi Hendrix posters. 'The rabbit man' this character living in the
hillside hard chapparel would come down with handmade rabbit pelt purses and jackets and get hassled even after paying for his table by security. Security never hassled a creep named Charlie and his 'family' who periodically showed up. There was another table selling incense. They had one called MONASTERY only it wasn't frankincense or anything else
I could name. But it was lovely and they refused to divulge it's ingredients and one day failed to return. You get older and a lot of things are mere memories; standout wines, a discontinued candy etc that you can at least name with the few who also experienced them.
The world is legion with such lost treasures and technologies we cannot replicate. In all honesty, I'd as soon pass on an unlabeled item as love it without possibility of future replicating it in some fashion.