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#31
(01-08-2017, 10:09 PM)Marcos Wrote: When I first started with DE I picked up a DE89. Couldn't stand it. It took way too many passes to accomplish what my Fusion could do in a single pass. I eventually sold the razor and didn't go back to DE for a couple of years. I wish I started with a nice med aggressive razor that was efficient from the get go and that would also teach me immediately about light pressure. Oh well live and learn

So what do you use now?
#32

Member
Northern NJ
Currently using and ATT R2 and a ATT SE2 old version. After I ditched the DE 89 I went to a Cobra Classic and the a Folding DX and a Japanese SS.
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#33

Member
Indianapolis Indiana
I would suggest a new user try a Maggar brand razor.
You can start with a basic V3 head, and a basic handle MR1 for around 20 bucks.

From there you can change handles, for size and weight, etc. and also swap out heads to see if another type would suit you better.
The have The V3A Head which is a bit more aggressive than the V3, A Open comb the V2 and a slant head.

This will allow any new shaver to experiment with four different types of heads and find a handle that fits just great.
Best thing about this, when you swap heads say to try a slant razor, you have isolated that one variable, leaving the rest as they are.
This way you know for sure it is the head and not the fact that the rest of the shavers geometry did not add to the difference.

Once you find just what you like, you can them move on to collecting every razor of that type that has ever been created.
When I die, I want to go like Gramps, quiet in his sleep - Not screaming like the passengers riding in his car.
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#34
Let's push the theory to the extreme and lay down the rule that no newbie can try a DE or SE without first spending at least two weeks learning to use a straight.  Evilgrin

I'm only half-joking. There's nothing like a straight for learning "zero pressure" and "effective angle", and once you attain a basic level of competence any other razor looks easy. Food for thought?
--
Viseguy
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#35

Sophisticated Stooge
Corpus Christi, TX
(This post was last modified: 02-19-2017, 12:26 AM by merelymoe. Edit Reason: grammar )
(02-18-2017, 11:44 PM)Viseguy Wrote: There's nothing like a straight for learning "zero pressure" and "effective angle", and once you attain a basic level of competence any other razor looks easy.

This statement sums up the gist of my argument perfectly. A straight or "aggressive" DE/SE will let you know in the first few shaves what "zero pressure" and "effective angle" really are. I know that for me, I could pick up any DE/SE with ease as my technique was dialed in during my trial by fire with the R41. In turn, I am able to appreciate the other features and nuances of a new razor without worrying about being "bitten" by what others might label aggressive.
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#36
(02-19-2017, 12:26 AM)merelymoe Wrote:
(02-18-2017, 11:44 PM)Viseguy Wrote: There's nothing like a straight for learning "zero pressure" and "effective angle", and once you attain a basic level of competence any other razor looks easy.
This statement sums up the gist of my argument perfectly.  A straight or "aggressive" DE/SE will let you know in the first few shaves what "zero pressure" and "effective angle" really are.  I know that for me, I could pick up any DE/SE with ease as my technique was dialed in during my trial by fire with the R41.  In turn, I am able to appreciate the other features and nuances of a new razor without worrying about being "bitten" by what others might label aggressive.
Granted, but -- to play the devil's advocate to my devil's advocate  Evilgrin Angel Evilgrin -- so much depends on the individual. Some may be driven away by an early bad experience with an aggressive razor, others may feel motivated to overcome the challenge. So my bottom line is, "whatever works for you" -- much as I'd like to see all beginners at least try a straight.  Smile
--
Viseguy
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#37

Administrator
Philadelphia, PA
merelymoe, just dropping in to give you kudos for this thread. for a long time, I've been in the "mild but efficient" camp. a few weeks ago I got to try the R41 for the first time and it was quite the shave. granted, I have a beard and only shave the bottom half of my neck (really where my skin is the most sensitive), but I was able to achieve a close shave with almost 0 irritation.

I think the whole aggressive razor thing is very dependent on the type of skin & facial hair you have. for me, my skin is sensitive and my hair is black, coarse and thick...my hair is also curly when it grows out a few days and it lays very flat against my skin - the perfect recipe for irritation and bumps.
Tu ne cede malis, sed contra audentior ito.
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#38

Restitutor Orbis
Now I'm tempted to try the R41..
#39

Member
Seattle
I've been reading this thread for a long time. I started my post-cart life about four years ago with a Merkur 34C HD. I couldn't get a close shave with it, so I dove into the ATT experience, first with an R2. Then I got the entire OC set, adding the M2, H2 and S2. I landed on the H2, but thought there might be closer, longer-lasting shaves out there. So my aggressive RAD kicked in, focused on vintage Gillettes. If I could do it all over again, my first razor would have been an H2, followed by a FaTip, followed by the Muhle R41 2011, then the Ikon Tech, Le Coq caged comb, PAA DOC Evolution stainless, Timeless .95 open comb and Charcoal Goods Level 3 open comb. Instead, I went down a vintage Gillette rabbit hole, and don't use any of them anymore, although I enjoy owning a piece of sophisticated US engineering and manufacturing history. Of course, this is me, and everyone is different.
--Scott
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#40
(12-06-2016, 08:05 PM)merelymoe Wrote: I was perusing my collection yesterday when I realized I have quite a few razors that fall into that dreaded "aggressive" label in my collection.  In my collection are the Micromatic OC, 2013 R41, Ikon Shavecraft Tech and the ATT H2 (honorable mention to my Slim Adjustable set at 9).

It got me to thinking.  When I first started out on this journey, I purchased an EJ89 because of all the recommendations you read day in and day out.  As much as I enjoyed moving into the world of wet shaving, I never got a truly close comfortable shave from the EJ89.  My next razor was the R41 because I wanted to see what all the hubbub was about.  What an eye opener!  I honed (pun very much intended) my skills more in one week with the R41 then the months I struggled with the EJ89.  The R41 taught me all about pressure and angle in a very short time.  Since then, I've been able to apply that knowledge with every razor I've used with excellent shave results.  It was great learning experience I can only equate to learning the art of driving a manual transmission and then being able to drive any car with ease.

Would we be serving our beginners better by recommending aggressive razors instead of the usual milder razors or is it better for them to crawl first and then run?

Thoughts?


I must say that words of advice can take a psychological effect for those that are newbies in the shaving world. Take it from a newbie that has been shaving for just a few months. I decided to think outside the box and take the leap of faith when dealing with aggressive razors.  The horror stories associated with buying aggressive razors you will not come out of it alive. The Muhle R41 puts Dracula to shame. If you continue on that path newbie you will need a whole new body since you will lose so much blood that blood transfusions would not be enough. Again it takes the will of determination just to say buy that aggressive razor. I understand the intentions of those that are sages in the shaving world even going as far as giving advice to newbies to stay away from aggressive razors, however I feel that this is actually discouraging to those that are just starting out. As you already know some have even been trapped for years with just mild razors just to find out later in the their life that aggressive razors or not bad at all. I did not crawl first and then run I took out my Blackbird SR-71 and went full force Tongue .  My enthusiasm drove me to find out what I can about the shaving world and still learning Party . Thanks for your time from a newbie to the sages.

[Image: lockheed_sr_71_blackbird-1920x1200.jpg]
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